Conservatives have a lot easier time dealing with people who oppose them.

You didn't read Texaii'a comments very carefully.

It's just an observation, and if you feel I'm way off, that's cool. I'm not trying to be a jerk to you. I was just trying to express care, not call you out or anything.

Baker, You do get uptight, you know.

J: By that rationale, though, why have political debates? Is there a chance that Kerry was going to be really persuasive and Bush was going to slap his head and say "Why didn't I think of that..."

Nah. Persuasion is nice, but in the end I'd be surprised if a millionth of the debates throughout history ended up swaying one or the other side. It does make good material for people who watch and haven't made their minds up, though.

I think when many talk about Liberal Americans not doing a good job getting the word out, that is a symptom. Sure, they may know they are right and wash their hands of you without bothering to fight it out, but they don't realize the smallest fraction of those witnessing the debate are actually in it, at least around here.

Steve: I know. Tex knows too. The situation I am refering to was unfortunate and born more of misunderstanding than difference, I think. Still, it was kind of the same situation here, and I think it reflects more of how I deal with people who mischaracterize me than it does a trend in my relations around here.

I take you seriously. I take Kingbee and Bahu seriously. No one takes cartoons seriously, and when people lack any depth or dimension, toss a catchphrase and walk they don't come off as anything BUT a catchphrase. I have faith that when we start freefalling toward the election we'll gain quite a few new Libs.

theres not much debate among conservatives/rightwing nuts/hypocrites because they march in lock step.

an example of this is any vote in the house ... republicans will vote the same way ... WITHOUT thought.

these people dont stray far from the talking points which are
1) america is number one and gwb sits at gods right hand
2) your with us or against us
3) we decide who is a terrorist
4) we have NEVER done any wrong
5) we are the moral guide of the world
6) its bill clintons fault
7) did i mention clinton
8) see 6 and 7
9) refer to 8
10) 6 and 7 ... when in DOUBT 8

I vaguely recall a conversation I had with someone who blurted out
"you liberals (small note here, I am not a liberal) listen to right wing radio to get a sense of what we
are thinking ... we onthe other hand have no desire to listen to left wing radio"

I told him point blank:
if thats the case, then its because "we" are
1) NOT threatened by your ideology
2) ARE free thinkers ... willing to hear other point of views if they are RATIONAL
3) ARE not robots or mindless drowns without intellectual curiosity

He babble some idiotic talking point before adding a new one:
the WAR on christmas

MORONS

rombios is an odd case. Sometimes he claims to be in a south American country embittered by US intervention, and other times he talks about the US in the first person, as if he is here and a citizen. The one fact seems to be he refuses to get an account and start blogging, which makes me think maybe we already know him and the IP thing is a problem...

theres not much debate among conservatives/rightwing nuts/hypocrites because they march in lock step. an example of this is any vote in the house ... republicans will vote the same way ... WITHOUT thought. these people dont stray far from the talking points which are 1) america is number one and gwb sits at gods right hand 2) your with us or against us 3) we decide who is a terrorist 4) we have NEVER done any wrong 5) we are the moral guide of the world 6) its bill clintons fault 7) did i mention clinton 8) see 6 and 7 9) refer to 8 10) 6 and 7 ... when in DOUBT 8

I am considered by most here on JU and other places, to be an "extreme" right-winger. And I'm here to tell you that you couldn't be more wrong if you tried on all 10 lines.

But I hope not to be arrogant enough to consider that I know everything.

Non-arguable axiom.

but you negated it with this single word.

Agreed.

And why let our opinions keep you from expressing yourself?

I don't, but I have other writing interests, but as Baker implies at election time I'll leap out of my spider web!

republicans will vote the same way ... WITHOUT thought.

This is the kind of thing that infuriates conservatives--lighten up. Of course, many of them are guilty of the same witless comments.

I think the main difference between liberals and conservatives is that conservatives believe in moral absolutes, and liberals don't, for the most part. And when conservatives STATE their beliefs, they're accused of being bigoted by liberals who want affirmation for their vices

Relative morality need not support "vices." The true thrust of morality is to assess whether absolutes are arbitrary or substantially relevant to daily living.

>rombios is an odd case.

by odd you mean "non conformist" .. fine I accept that.

>Sometimes he claims to be in a south American country embittered by US intervention


I never claimed to be from any South American country. I did say I have friends from all over th world
have similar stories ... thats
CIA/NSA/NGO has been used to topple democratically elected governments that were viewed as socialist,
on who happened to PUT THEIR PEOPLE first before alliances with the USofA

what I have from my friends confirms the stories in Johnsons "BlowBack" ... a good read.

>and other times he talks about the US in the first person, as if he is here and a citizen.

Prove I am not?

>The one fact seems to be he refuses to get an account and start blogging

Has it ever occured to you that I have no interest lin playing this game under YOUR rules Bakestreet?
I love that you continuously raise this point ... you and Dr Guy.

That this continues to be a sore on your side ... is a source of never ending joy for me.

>which makes me think maybe we already know him and the IP thing is a problem...

Whatever dude!
I am surprised you are even bothering to respond to me ... in an earlier post (on a different subject) you said
you would never respond to anything I write on here ... youve folded like a leaf.!!!

You and Dr Guy love to censor and delete posts you dont agree with ... why should I or others bother signing
up?
Your attempts to pigeon hole me and like minded individuals are a waste of time ... I share ideas and view
points with liberals (privacy, sane foreign policy, protection from corrupt business/corporation) and with
conservatives (flat/low tax, small government, right to bear arms).

That so called "liberal" label isnt so fixed ... now is it?

I may not agree with Gideon but I respect him and his willingness to challenge ANY point he doesnt agree
with.

Nuff said!

I think the main difference between liberals and conservatives is that conservatives believe in moral absolutes, and liberals don't, for the most part. And when conservatives STATE their beliefs, they're accused of being bigoted by liberals who want affirmation for their vices. When conservatives frustrate me, though, is when they attempt to legislate all of their moral positions. I can believe something's wrong without trying to outlaw, it, frankly.

I disagree here on many fronts.  First, both sides tend to think that there are moral absolutes. They just choose what those moral absolutes are differently.  Left-wing orthodoxy strikes me as dogmatically religious as right-wing Christian fundamentalists.

And while it is annoying when right-wingers try to push their beliefs on us in the form of law, at least they're using the democratic mechanism.  Left-wingers, by contrast, tend to try to use the courts which are not answerable to the people. 

For example, I'm pro-choice.  But the decision whether abortion should be legal or not should be in the hands of elected officials, not unelected judges.

I hadn't noticed their exodus.

Not exodus, ostracization.

but you negated it with this single word.

No, he negated it with his single thought.  One cannot make a dog a cat, or a thinking person from a stump.