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AdamaCaprica
AdamaCaprica
Join Date 02/2008
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My feedback regarding ship damage / destruction effects

February 6, 2008 7:35:10 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Hello!

Firstly, I would like to say that I am really enjoying this game. Thank you devs for a polished, stable and immersive experience from the word go. Now onto business!

I experienced a few skirmishes last night and noticed a few things. Ship models simply disappear while they explode. I like the fire, smoke and debris etc but the overall effect is spoiled when the main hulk disappears into thin air. Not so noticeable at a distance though. Is this a bug or perhaps something that requires an adjustment? Is the ship meant to disappear once the explosions have fully engulfed / surrounded the model?

Sorry, I know it sounds awfully picky… but I just want to help make an already polished game even shinier!

Also, can the damage effects be enhanced at all for high-end systems? People remember Haegemonia will remember the splendid explosions. I would love to see, for example, capital ships break in half while exploding. More wreckage would add to the aftermath of battle. To solve performance and clutter issues, the wreckage could become caught in the nearby gravity well and slowly disintegrate! A simple fade with a dash of fiery colour would do the job.

Ok all done! Off to lunch!
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AdamaCaprica
The Byte
Join Date 02/2006
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Reply #1 February 6, 2008 7:48:52 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Couldn't agree more. The explosions in haegemonia were the best i've seen yet. Even if they dont have the resources to generate death animations for everything maybe some more debris would do the trick.
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AdamaCaprica
AdamaCaprica
Join Date 02/2008
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Reply #2 February 6, 2008 8:40:39 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Absolutely!

Just to add, the smaller ships don't necessary need any more work done to them, just please ensure they don't simply disappear into thin air while they explode!

Larger ships however, especially the disappearing act mention in my original post, needs to be looked at. Or if it is a bug, please fix! Thanks!
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AdamaCaprica
L337Rambo
Join Date 02/2008
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Reply #3 February 6, 2008 9:13:48 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Yes more debris and explosions would be A+++++. The game is awesome, best space game ever. It would be cooler to see the ships break into many more pieces and have the pieces of the debris just float away into empty space.
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AdamaCaprica
LazySumo
Join Date 04/2006
+1
Reply #4 February 6, 2008 9:31:51 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Add to this the shipyards. Zoom in on one and watch as it builds your ship, once the building animation is done the ship 'magically' appears two hundred yards away and sails off. Sob!
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AdamaCaprica
AdamaCaprica
Join Date 02/2008
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Reply #5 February 6, 2008 9:40:27 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Yes! Thank you for reminding me about that. I noticed it when I built my first free Capital Ship. I don't mind the simplistic building animation as it's not something I'm going to be watching often. But I would much prefer my ships to leave the dock slowly and assume a basic formation at the rally point instead of appearing outside of the dock in an instant!

Just another minor niggle... heh!
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AdamaCaprica
Mtn_Man
Join Date 02/2008
+13
Reply #6 February 6, 2008 11:04:53 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I imagine these are all deliberate compromises to make the game scalable for as wide a range of systems as possible. It would probably be too much work to create special animations, etc. for high-end computers.
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AdamaCaprica
TotalBiscuit
Join Date 02/2008
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Reply #7 February 6, 2008 11:25:51 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Definately going to agree with that one. See Nexus : The Jupiter Incident, for examples of good explosions/debris.
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AdamaCaprica
AdamaCaprica
Join Date 02/2008
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Reply #8 February 6, 2008 11:38:35 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I imagine these are all deliberate compromises to make the game scalable for as wide a range of systems as possible. It would probably be too much work to create special animations, etc. for high-end computers.


I do understand this, I really do. And I think it's fantastic that the game scales so well, so almost everyone can play. But deliberate compromises may not have been necessary, if they were included as more options in the menu to adjust, instead of permanently changing / removing things for everyone.

This is all based on conjecture, I know. And the game may have never had the kind of damage model I am thinking about. However, perhaps additions / updates will be included for people who do have the necessary hardware. Again, this wouldn’t be an issue for players with lower specifications, so long as it’s all configurable in the main menu.

Anyway, if a dev could confirm that the disappearing exploding ship is a bug or a design mishap that would be great. Has anyone else seen what I described in my original post?
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AdamaCaprica
Mtn_Man
Join Date 02/2008
+13
Reply #9 February 6, 2008 11:56:15 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I do understand this, I really do. And I think it's fantastic that the game scales so well, so almost everyone can play. But deliberate compromises may not have been necessary, if they were included as more options in the menu to adjust, instead of permanently changing / removing things for everyone.

As someone once said, the formula for making the perfect game is simple:

infinite time + infinite resources = perfect game

At any rate, I do appreciate that perspective, but looking at it from the developer's perspective, they could unify the graphics code and only have one code tree to debug and optimize, or they could have multiple hardware dependent code trees that would exponentially multiply their workload for little benefit. I think other games can get away with more detailed effects like that simply because their scope and scale is significantly smaller.

But in response to your OP, yes, I've seen that effect myself, where a ship will suddenly vanish and an explosion were appear in its place. That is to say I've noticed it, but it hasn't bothered me in the slightest.
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AdamaCaprica
LazySumo
Join Date 04/2006
+1
Reply #10 February 7, 2008 4:56:12 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Mtn Man,

I imagine these are all deliberate compromises to make the game scalable for as wide a range of systems as possible. It would probably be too much work to create special animations, etc. for high-end computers.


Mountain Man, hate to do this to such a fine thread, but here goes...

Homeworld managed to have ships come out of the shipyards and take up station/fly to rally point without an issue ALMOST A DECADE AGO.

Don't get me wrong, I love Sins, awesome game and IC has my money and money from several RL friends of mine so it HAS to be a great game, right? But there are some basic things that computers in 1999 (Homeworld release year) could handle just fine. You can't honestly tell me that this game scales back to hardware from 1998.

IronClad, give us those detail animations that we know our comps can handle, come on guys. We're all grognards to some degree or another in here (or else we would be out playing TF2) and yes the details DO matter.

No rotating turrets? BAH.
Ships don't leave drydock? BAH!
Bombs come in from out of nowhere? DOUBLE BAH!
Fighters blip all over? Oh come on! BAH.

Such an awesome game, I love it and will play it, but you guys KNOW you can manage to get all those things right.
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AdamaCaprica
Pill7
Join Date 11/2007
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Reply #11 February 7, 2008 5:02:30 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I agree, it can't be too hard to make a ship float out of the hanger instead of teleporting out. But it is still an amazing game. No slight graphical glitch can change that.
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AdamaCaprica
LazySumo
Join Date 04/2006
+1
Reply #12 February 7, 2008 5:10:20 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
It's not a graphical glitch Pill, someone simply took a shortcut instead of coding the proper response to the shipyard finishing it's job. You're right, it's an awesome game and I love it, but it's like looking at a gorgeous automobile and thinking how pretty it is and the whole time you know in the back of your head that you have to hit the trunk *just right* to get it to open because the auto-maker didn't align the hinges properly. No, it doesn't deter how pretty the car is, how fast it is, how well it handles, none of that. But you just know it's not perfect.
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AdamaCaprica
Stagetech
Join Date 10/2005
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Reply #13 February 16, 2008 10:42:16 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
My question regarding damage is when is it applied? The damage calculations have been driving me up the wall.
It seems that the calculation vs the graphic dmg has nothing in common. I have seen missiles that chase the target, its takes dmg, then the missiles hit a few seconds later.
Same with Advent beams, they hit, nothing, then halfway through the beam the dmg applies.
So, is the dmg applied independently from the graphic or is there some relation that I am missing?
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AdamaCaprica
Pnakotus
Join Date 03/2006
+5
Reply #14 February 16, 2008 11:23:06 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
The problem is really just a timing one. The smaller ships disappear when the explosion STARTS, and thus isn't obscuring the ship yet. Even games like HW2 used the old-fashioned 'wait for the explosion to hide the ship then delete the model' method.

We can't all have FS2-style debris fragments.
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