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iamheather
iamheather
Join Date 10/2001
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Bush Authorized Torture?

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December 23, 2004 6:55:35 PM from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

The ACLU is launching another attack against President Bush. Most everyone has heard about the ACLU's acquisition of "proof" that the president issued a directive authorizing the "torture" of terrorist suspects detained at Guantanamo Bay.

What is their proof? They claim to have emails from FBI agents. These emails refer to a new Bush order on prisoner treatment that supposedly permits interrogation tactics beyond normal procedure.

Where is this supposed directive? The ACLU has no copy of any directive by the President allowing any such thing.

The New York Times wrote:

"The records did not include a copy of the Bush order, or make clear exactly when it was signed. Pentagon officials would not comment on whether there was any new order."

The documents the ACLU has provided are "Urgent Report" memorandums between Dec. 5, 2003, and June 24, 2004. These emails chronicle cases of abuses and possible cover-ups. At no point do they name Bush.

 

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iamheather
greywar
Join Date 05/2003
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Reply #1 December 23, 2004 10:44:12 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
the ACLU has no time for "fact" or "evidence" and while the documents might not be genuine "the story is true". Maybe Rather is earning some consultancy fees on the side?
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iamheather
Dr Guy
Join Date 09/2004
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Reply #2 December 24, 2004 2:06:12 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

It is a smoke screen designed to prepare the way for the democrats to try an impeachment. It will not fly as it is not true.

But while Clinton had a lot of trash under his fingernails, Bush pretty much is an open book.  But like his father before him, the Liberals dont care about proof, just the 'seriousness' of the charges.  They need to taint any conservative with the black brush, and only have innunedo not facts.

In fact, if you read their articles, you find no proof, just innuendo, and no evidence.  Just opinion.

Sad, but then we have to endure their vitriol as they lost power through the electorate, and instead of appealing to them, they rely on lies, subterfuge and hate.

They still have not learned.  It is time for them to go away.  Maybe nader can start a new liberal party based upon issues and ideas, not lies and hate.

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iamheather
dabe
Join Date 09/2003
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Reply #3 December 24, 2004 2:54:40 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
The ACLU is but one group that is merely asking the questions[/B that no one else wants to ask]. They are very legitimate, and yet to be answered. They are not making false alegations, just asking questions based on past histories. See the following article:

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/outrage?bid=13&pid=2085 Link


Maybe, even check out some of the links on that page, before you go trashing people for asking the very pertinent questions.
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iamheather
Dr Guy
Join Date 09/2004
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Reply #4 December 24, 2004 3:22:51 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

They are not making false alegations, just asking questions based on past histories. See the following article:


Baapp!  Wrong!  Did you read it?  It is an acusation.  You dont ask questions by starting them with "When did you stop beating your wife".


You would be more credible if you did not have so much hate.

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iamheather
dabe
Join Date 09/2003
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Reply #5 December 24, 2004 8:47:22 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
So, tell me Dr. Guy... what if the accusations are correct? Would you still support this administration? Or, are you just saying that you don't care?

Fact of the matter, Bush likely did know about, if not specifically authorize the torture. After all, the buck stops at his office, and these things happened under his watch, and he hired the lawyer who stretched the legal interpretations to permit these unconscionable acts of violence. And, the fact is, the only people paying the price for these crimes are the little guys, the soldiers who were following orders to "soften up" the detainees. I'd like to see those responsible for authorizing this be held accountable. That would be the Pentagon, Gonzales, and likely Bush, himself. The soldiers are merely scapegoats. It is for this reason that the ACLU is asking the questions, making likely accusations that the higher ups not only authorized, but directed the troops to commit war crimes.

It's not about me and my hate. It's about the Bush administration and their disregard of soldiers, their proclivity towards deflecting responsibility, and their assinine decisions that got this country and the soldiers into this war in the first place. It amazes me how every time I bring up a political issue, you turn it around and accuse me of hate. Talk about deflecting issues................................
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iamheather
Dr Guy
Join Date 09/2004
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Reply #6 December 24, 2004 9:01:48 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

So, tell me Dr. Guy... what if the accusations are correct? Would you still support this administration? Or, are you just saying that you don't care?


When did you stop beating your children?  Are we to call child services?  it is an accusation.  So it must be right.

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iamheather
dabe
Join Date 09/2003
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Reply #7 December 25, 2004 7:32:20 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Bush hired Gonzales, for cryin' out loud. The same dipshit asshole who provided BUSH with the legal interpretations that allowed the torture. Yes, BUSH the bum who's running the White Wash, I mean House. The torture scandal has set this war effort back bigtime, and become one of this administration's worst bunglings since venturing into Iraq in the first place. No wonder someone, in this case the ACLU is asking questions. AND MAKING ALLEGATIONS. Bush supports Gonzolas. Hello...................... There is a very strong connection here (which, btw, has nothing to do with whether or not I beat my children). If he's guilty, how would anyone know unless the questions, and yes, allegations were never voiced?

But we agree on one thing, Helix. If Bush is found to be not guilty on this one issue, I'll still hate him. There is nothing he, or the rest of his administration can do, short of taking responsibility for the Iraq fiasco, assault on the environment, tanking the economy, padding the wallets of pharmaceuticals and other corporations, and his assault on secular government, nothing he can do other than STEP DOWN and give up running this country. Yeah, I'm dug in deep, and I'll never give up.
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iamheather
dabe
Join Date 09/2003
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Reply #8 December 25, 2004 9:26:49 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
On second thought..............

As far as the allegation that I may beat my children, I've experienced that. I took my four year old daughter to the emergency room because of a gash in her forehead that she sustained from an accident involving play with neighbors. My husband and I were questioned by hospital staff to discern whether the injury resulted from child abuse. They determined that we were not abusing our daughter. But, I was happy at the time that they did ask the question, accusing us of the possibility, because that is the only way they can screen abusers. I do not want anyone purposefully inflicting injuries on children to go unpunished.

So, the correlation you make between the possibility that I may be abusing my children and accusing the Bushies of perpetrating the fraud that enabled the torture is clearly supporting my case, thank you very much.
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iamheather
Dr Guy
Join Date 09/2004
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Reply #9 December 25, 2004 9:53:16 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

As far as the allegation that I may beat my children, I've experienced that. I took my four year old daughter to the emergency room because of a gash in her forehead that she sustained from an accident involving play with neighbors. My husband and I were questioned by hospital staff to discern whether the injury resulted from child abuse. They determined that we were not abusing our daughter. But, I was happy at the time that they did ask the question, accusing us of the possibility, because that is the only way they can screen abusers. I do not want anyone purposefully inflicting injuries on children to go unpunished.


So since you were accused, it must be so, even tho there is no evidence.  Poor child.

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