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Manick2005
Manick2005
Join Date 09/2008
+1

Why is the AI so suicidally aggressive towards humans in FFA?

August 4, 2013 9:56:54 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Every time I play a 4P FFA with the computer, nearly every faction will do everything in their power to screw me over as early as possible.  They will even completely stop trying to take over neutral planets right next to them if it means getting 1 more ship to the frontlines.  And they're stupid about how they use their units too, to the point where they'll gladly let me kill their capital ship.  But they can just replace it in the next minute anyway, so it doesn't matter if I kill it.  This wouldn't be a problem in 1v1, if the other two factions weren't also so dead set on expanding towards me and taking every planet near my home world.  What am I supposed to do about this?

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Manick2005
Rovert10
Join Date 06/2011
+19
Reply #1 August 4, 2013 10:27:40 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

That's just your perspective I think. They seem to be just as aggressive to other AIs as well in my experience

Really it's either getting better at the game or turn down the difficulty levels at bit. 4 Player FFA always have 2 people surrounding you. The AI will expand both ways so they will meet up with you down the middle. Same goes for every other AI.

I think you're just not expanding fast enough and allowing the AI to steamroll expand towards you. Though I can't say anything without any replay of said game.

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Manick2005
Manick2005
Join Date 09/2008
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Reply #2 August 4, 2013 10:51:05 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Rovert10,
reply 1

That's just your perspective I think. They seem to be just as aggressive to other AIs as well in my experience

Really it's either getting better at the game or turn down the difficulty levels at bit. 4 Player FFA always have 2 people surrounding you. The AI will expand both ways so they will meet up with you down the middle. Same goes for every other AI.

I think you're just not expanding fast enough and allowing the AI to steamroll expand towards you. Though I can't say anything without any replay of said game.

 

First thing I always do is try to expand towards my neighbors within reason, especially if there's a valuable choke point between us.  I'll usually leave the planets that are behind me for later, unless they're really easy to capture. 

 I always do everything I can to start out as fast as possible too.  I buy 100 crystal for early civilian infrastructure upgrade on my homeworld, scuttle one of my frigate factories (and sometimes my capital ship factory too), always build a carrier as my first cap ship, and pop out a migrator as soon as my 2nd light frigate is complete.  I don't know how to start expanding any faster than that unless I built a colony cap ship.  I'm usually playing on hard or unfair btw, and I can beat unfair on 1v1 usually.

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Manick2005
Rovert10
Join Date 06/2011
+19
Reply #3 August 4, 2013 10:57:13 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Carrier capital start isn't great at least against players and probably against AI.

You're better off with using the Colony Capital Start.

Build a colony frigate to turret rush expand to a asteroid alone. Using colony capital and spam of light frigates to rush expand with it.

 

If anything you should probably abuse the fact the AI likes to throw ships at Starbases. Back it up with repair bays and some support frigates against Orgovs and you should be good on one side.

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Manick2005
Manick2005
Join Date 09/2008
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Reply #4 August 4, 2013 11:37:40 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Carriers are amazing though, especially the Vasari one.  Having an early game carrier vessel is incredibly valuable.  They can single handedly solo even the most heavily fortified neutral planets if high enough level because of how many fighters/bombers it can pop out.  I don't even need to send a handful of light frigates with him, and honestly sometimes I prefer not to since LRMs and kodiaks like to focus fire and kill them.

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Manick2005
Rovert10
Join Date 06/2011
+19
Reply #5 August 4, 2013 11:41:39 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Manick2005,
reply 4

Carriers are amazing though, especially the Vasari one.  Having an early game carrier vessel is incredibly valuable.  They can single handedly solo even the most heavily fortified neutral planets if high enough level because of how many fighters/bombers it can pop out.  I don't even need to send a handful of light frigates with him, and honestly sometimes I prefer not to since LRMs and kodiaks like to focus fire and kill them.

Well I suppose against AI maybe.

A Human player will just spam the hell out of corvettes to chase and kill your carrier capital easy. I haven't seen a carrier capital start in PvP games since Beta 1 of Rebellion.

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Manick2005
Turchany
Join Date 03/2009
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Reply #6 August 4, 2013 3:33:43 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Manick2005,
reply 4
Carriers are amazing though, especially the Vasari one.

 

Maybe if you pair it with the orky rush, but I guess it's not your case.

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Manick2005
GoaFan77
Join Date 10/2008
+629
Reply #7 August 4, 2013 5:58:20 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Rovert10,
reply 3
Carrier capital start isn't great at least against players and probably against AI.

I highly disagree. For newer players colony cap start is the gold standard as well as if you have a bit of time to expand, but if you want a more aggressive start carrier caps are great. They can even be better at colonizing if you have a lot of terrans and deserts nearby with heavy cruisers as their bombers are invaluable in the early game at clearing them out, and in very close quarters you should not underestimate an Embargo rush or Orky rush with a Skirantra with healing support.

Quoting Rovert10,
reply 5
A Human player will just spam the hell out of corvettes to chase and kill your carrier capital easy. I haven't seen a carrier capital start in PvP games since Beta 1 of Rebellion.

But this can apply to any capitalship rush. It not a weakness exclusive to carriers. If you are going to attempt it you'll need more ships than your opponent to avoid this, as you can hopefully kill his fleet before they get your carriers. And as you say, the AI will not chase down caps in the same way a human player can.

 

4P FFA

Is it an open diplomacy free for all? If so, make sure you don't pick a race like the TEC Rebels that most other factions hate, and try to invest in some of the relationship increasing techs. While 4P FFA might be to small for you to see the mechanic, since you are pretty much forced to fight one of your nearby opponents, but on larger games you can easily ally with over half the players on the map and just pick them off one by one. 

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Manick2005
V00DOO
Join Date 11/2012
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Reply #8 August 5, 2013 3:27:49 PM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

One of my fav starts is first marza then fast kol.  This slows your expansion but high level kols are incredibly important for clearing bomber swarms beause flak frigates are just way too slow and tec fighters dont come in suficcient numbers.

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Manick2005
candido-
Join Date 04/2003
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Reply #9 August 5, 2013 9:10:12 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Rovert10,
reply 5
I haven't seen a carrier capital start in PvP games since Beta 1 of Rebellion.

 

Sova carrier upgraded to level 3 with embargo for a 2v1 on a suicide position is pretty standard.

 

 

 

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Manick2005
GeomanNL
Join Date 05/2013
+5
Reply #10 August 6, 2013 3:38:40 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I suppose you're playing against hard AI?

1. Build turrets and repair bays to defend your worlds.

2. When you've got 5 planets or more, invest in starbases (and keep expanding if possible). That will make the AI stop attacking you all the time with small fleets.

3. After this, go on the offensive.

4. (In case you've unlocked teams) Ally one of the other AI's, choose the neighbouring AI that has best attitude with you at the time. Don't bother about the one with lesser attitude, it'll just keep attacking you and it won't really work. Send envoys to his worlds (and in case they're destroyed, replace them). Research envoy-diplomacy to boost the relations. Also give him money occasionally to boost relations.

 

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